In our latest episode, we chat with Jeanne Eichler about music, the arts community, and thoughts on community and connection during and beyond COVID.
In our latest episode, we chat with Jeanne Eichler about music, the arts community, and thoughts on community and connection during and beyond COVID.
Hi folks. Welcome to the, do what you love podcast. It's Anna here, and I invite you to join Emily and I, as we dive into doing what we love, having conversations with occupational therapists, scientists, and individuals from around the world, connecting the dots between doing belonging, becoming and wellbeing. Although we are both occupational therapists and some of our guests, our health and wellbeing professionals, this podcast is personal opinions of knowledge, and it is intended to be used in informational manner only. Under no circumstances should this podcast substitute for a call or a visit with a trusted healthcare professional that is, or can become familiar with your lived experience. Hello everyone! Today, we're excited to be joined by Jeanne Eichler. What is one of your favorite things to do and what does it bring to your life?
Jeanne Eichler:Well, I love to do anything that's creative, whether it be designing a program, cooking or baking art projects or making music. And I have lots of favorites, the music has impacted my life and practice in the most ways. Uh, music making gives me an avenue for personal self-expression in my own life. When I use music in the clinic or classroom, I feel like I'm bringing a piece of myself, including my own vulnerability, into the work that I'm doing. That vulnerability is an incredible way to experience a moment of growth or transformation with my student or client.
Anna Braunizer:Thank you. Emily was telling me about how you bring that music into occupational therapy a little bit. What led you to integrating music and occupational therapy?
Jeanne Eichler:I was working in an occupational... an occupational therapy and speech clinic as a music therapist, and immediately saw how music could help bring out the things that they were trying to get the children to do in the clinic. Uh, like being able to sit on a ball for a long period of time, or sometimes would be the first person to get somebody's speech when no one else could get the child to talk. Some of the music interventions that I knew as a music therapist would get them moving or talking in ways that the other therapist couldn't get as quickly. And so that's when I decided I needed to move into, um, occupational therapy and bring my music with me. It never goes too far.
Anna Braunizer:Hmm.
Emily Polovick-Moulds:Thank you for sharing that tool. I know that, um, being in your class back when I was an undergrad, it was a really- it was a joy to be able to have, you know, the different impacts of it and to do a drum circle or to know that you can bring those parts of yourself into what we're doing, because like you were saying, that's, that's what really makes the relationship with your client. And that's what lets them feel like they can bring out what they have and that's really the whole purpose of what we're doing. Um, so how do you feel like the arts really impact. Your own wellbeing or the ones, the people around you. You've kind of already mentioned that it allows you to do so many more things, but if you could just speak a little bit more to that.
Jeanne Eichler:Yeah. Um, the arts, whatever the medium is, provide an Avenue for a vast experience. Everyone gets to participate, whether you're the music maker or the audience. And I use the audience word loosely here. In music therapy, they talk about something called the ISO principle and the ISO principle explains, um, that we can move someone from one energy level to another matching where we are and moving to where they want to be very similar to what accusational therapists do. Only music therapists do it with the sound and the rhythm. We're all free to respond to the arts individually differently. Even our own responses, depending on our current context may change. So it's always different music making is accessible to everyone in some way. And we're intrinsically rhythmic beings. Everything about us is organized for the specific and consistent rhythm when we are well, our heartbeat, our body functions, our movement, our ways of thinking and processing the list goes on. Nature is rhythmic. Look at the seasons. We're biologically disposed to utilize rhythm and wellness. Biologically, we will sync with the rhythms of others around us in just a few minutes. We're biologically sensitive to rhythm. That's something that happened in your class, right? Emily
Emily Polovick-Moulds:definitely,
Jeanne Eichler:I'm constantly fascinated with the sensory experience and how our neurological systems process, sensory input and impact how we interact and perform everything we do. Believe it or not, the sounds impact us on a cellular level in ways we cannot see and are hardly aware until we recognize the outcomes. And those are things like proprioception, because sound waves are actually felt by the bones in our body. Um, we, we can listen to sounds and the, and the things that we hear can impact our mood, um, and, and their ability to function in an environment. Maybe focus in an environment.
Anna Braunizer:Yeah. So music's like a co-regulation tool, like when we talk
Jeanne Eichler:yeah.It really is it's a great partner. And for the sensory system,
Emily Polovick-Moulds:how have you found that, um, your understanding of all this has evolved from that time that you were first working in the clinic as a music therapist to where you are now?
Jeanne Eichler:Well, every aspect of my background in music therapy has influenced my OT practice. Even those that I don't. Do you use directly? Um, with music when music taught me is that participating in the making of something can be extremely powerful and that engagement counts. There's a certain rush that comes with music making whether you're alone or with others. When we're allowed to engage and express ourselves within the structure of an experience, whether it be a well-practiced piece of music or an improvised them circle, we're making something unique to that moment. And we're expressing where we are at the time.
Emily Polovick-Moulds:That's really beautiful being able to be in the moment but within that structure, I think is something that in the last, maybe eight years, I guess that's where I've evolved to understand that that's really what makes all the difference. Cause you have to have the structure for most people to feel safe enough to be in the moment.
Anna Braunizer:Um, and how have you seen music, like impact like your family and friends or the arts impact your family and friends?
Jeanne Eichler:Well, I come from a really musical family. Uh I'm I'm the oldest of six kids and music has always impacted our family and our friends. If they have anything to do with us, um, when we get together as a family. Yeah. Even after many, many years, the thing that keeps us together and the thing that we can always do the doings in my family's life, typically center around. When are we going to stand around the piano and sing? What are we going to sing this year? Um, what are you singing now? What are you doing now? Um, sharing, uh, recordings. And, um, and it's, it's a way that we connect as a family and a lot of families connect like that. Um, connecting with friends, um, I. Sat in the front yard of a friend's house. Um, several times, um, w Baca back when the weather was a lot nicer than it is right now. And I brought my guitar. I always showed up with a wagon and a guitar and, and something to drink. And we sat on the front line and, and we would sing old songs together. And it was just a way to connect with new neighbors and, um, and, and really get to know them and have just some shared moments. Music brings people together in an interesting way. Yeah.
Anna Braunizer:I was just going to say that music, like it's a collective occupation and it really brings people together. Um, I also love music. I don't know if you've heard of come from away the musical?
Jeanne Eichler:No.
Anna Braunizer:Oh, okay. Well, I recommend you check it out. So it's a musical. Um, it's about what happened with 9/11 when all the planes were diverted to Gander and it's all about community and people coming together and kindness. Yeah, it's just so beautiful. So that, that just you talking about how you use music to bring people together, just remind me of that experience. Um, I'm also wondering
Jeanne Eichler:One of the things I did with my students, um, especially early on, it felt kind of lonely and dark. And, uh, I was teaching asynchronously for the first semester, once we, uh, went into lockdown for COVID. And so what I would do a lot of the time is start my class, my recording for my class, with a song and I'd sing something to them or, um, I would. Right. I had pictures of them and I would make a slide show and accompany it somehow. And it, somehow it helped me to connect with them. I'm not sure how they liked it because I never got to see how they liked it. But for me it was, it was like a way of connecting with my students in a time when we were asynchronous and uncertain. And it was to me, very powerful as a, as a college professor to do that with my students.
Anna Braunizer:Yeah. As, as a student, I had a professor who...she brought songs. She wasn't singing them, but she brought songs to the start of every lecture would start the lecture and the class-just set the tone of the class with a song. And I just remember it being so calming and just be like,'okay, now we're here ready to learn.'
Jeanne Eichler:Yep. Exactly. It's amazing. Isn't it?
Anna Braunizer:I follow lots of the occupational science literature and stuff is coming out, was talking about both the light and the dark sides of different occupations-um, the ways that they can contribute to wellbeing, but also the ways that people might not have access to them, or they could actually be used in a way that actually sometimes harm people's wellbeing. Um, what do you see on the spectrum of music, like in what ways does it contribute to wellbeing and in what ways might it be used with potentially malevolence or intent thatexcludes to a degree or maybe detracts from community.
Jeanne Eichler:Well, I listened to the words to songs. Um, not everybody does that, but I listened to the words of songs and because I like to sing along and I don't like to sing something that I wouldn't say. And so that excludes me from, from a lot of the music that's out right now. Um, and for some other people, it's the same thing, but there is a fine line between. That dark side that you're talking about. Like, like we got to watch how we interpret things sometimes because, um, especially in like teen years, um, kids will go off into their rooms and they'll blast their music really loudly, like, think about that experience of a blasting music super loudly. And you think about sound waves being entities that help with the organization. Um, and, and that could give us some additional insight on how that music could be impacting that, that person's sensory system. Like, what are they getting out of it? Does it have anything to do with the words? Sometimes they just say, you know what? I just liked the beat. Well, that could be really true. Their body could be feeling better because of that beat. Um, we may not be feeling better because it's so darn loud, but yeah. You know, you just, you never know, um, how we might interpret that. It also gives people a chance to when, when people are alone listening to music, it's a very private experience and can be, uh, a really, um, a really a good one to reflect at the same time, getting buried in music at the expense of not having relationships with other people can be very detrimental to someone. And so I think we just need to pay attention to how we see that music being used. And then we can decide how we want to intervene. And most of the time, I would say having a conversation about that music and starting with, you know, what is it that you're liking about this? Uh, what is it that you get out of this? Tell me about your experience with the music might be, uh, a good way to open up that discussion and maybe learn something about that person and what they're doing.
Anna Braunizer:Yeah. I really like how you touched on like how our judgements and biases on, uh, the way persons use music can not necessarily be true for how they're actually experiencing it and really opening the conversation. Um, I realized in the way I framed the question, I probably like had a little bit of bias and judgment in that, but I was like, it just reminded me again, like, just because this, I think this could be harmful is actually could be helpful and like having a conversation and looking at what it means. So thank you so much for bringing that up.
Jeanne Eichler:Um, yeah. You know, um, there's always a transaction right? Between the, the person, everything they've ever experienced in the music that you bring into the environment or the music experience that you bring into the environment and everything has our individual experiences typically shape that response. And so it can be pretty negative. In some cases, it might actually draw us to do negative things or things that aren't good for our health. Sometimes music is centered around activities that might be harmful or deliver a lot of pressure for people to participate, especially in group settings. Uh, group settings can influence a person's behavior and other ways maybe outside of the music, because there's always more to what's happening, uh, in, in music making or totally a situation where there is music.
Anna Braunizer:Yeah. Really delving into like that person's experience with it. And I guess on the flip side as well, is what I'm hearing is: sometimes we will look at what we perceive as the benefits of music, but because of our experience and the other person's experience, being different, they can experience it as something that's like a trigger or something that's really stressful for them. And having the conversation just be so opening to the therapeutic relationship to what they do and where they go in therapy.
Jeanne Eichler:Absolutely.
Emily Polovick-Moulds:Yeah. I do think it's so important to when we have that human to human connection, as we were saying, I think. I've heard a lot more in this year of most of us being home, but also over zoom and different things of trying to understand where the other person is at, because we don't know what's happening for them. And I feel like at least for me in my education, and now my OT practice so far, I think that's one of my favorite things about OTs is that we're trained to do that. We're trained to look at all the different factors, their environment, and how they grew up and all those different things, because we don't know their experience. So I think that's one of our greatest resources, but that does bring me to our next question of what are some other resources that you found are helpful for influencing wellbeing? Um, and our ability to actually do what we love.
Jeanne Eichler:This was one of my favorite things to think about. Um, and you know, in my own life, I, I would, I would suggest, uh, that you put creative opportunities in your environment where you can see them and engage easily with them. So I have a piano in my living room and every time I pass it, which I do all the time, it invites me to engage in music making, even for a minute. Having an art project in-progress makes it easy to engage during short breaks or intentional creative time. Putting the ingredients out for baking that new cake recipe makes me actually doing it more likely to happen. So. Sharing and doing with others is important. I told you before, I love to sing with my family, my first and favorite ensemble in the world. It's a way to belong and participate with each other. When we come together, a common space that we all share and have a part in. I love to be in an ensemble with others to drumming, and other types of rhythm circles are really great for this. So finding them in terms of resources, there are lots of very, very creative people. We're talking about the creative arts and so creative artists think of workarounds that are unique all the time. And, um, so the creative artists in my circles. Are teaching art classes online on zoom, or they're doing drum circles. And not only can they do their drum circles in the community now, but we're drumming with people all over the world. And people are some really interesting instruments to those experiences. Um, we have people who have developed. Facebook sites, uh, for concerts and people are recording things that they're making up in their living rooms and it's, it's incredible. And so, um, wherever we look, we can find ways to access that music. Um, even if it's accessing music that, uh, that is just in our own house that we don't realize is music.
Anna Braunizer:I remember I was participating in this whole course by Isabel Fryszberg- I don't know if you've heard of her; she's in Toronto- about integrating the arts and practice and we had our discussion boards and she's just kinda like started building this community around the arts. And it's just been, it's been really nice. Like I found like that was therapeutic for me. Like there are all these like weekly art prompts and we shared our art and we talked about our art and they were like from poems to paintings, to music to song like it was, it was a really one way to connect with OTs from across Canada. And then I've been doing this course by London arts club in England and I usually go to the Matisse ones'cause I love Matisse, but it's like how to do art, like Matisse. And it's been really fun.
Jeanne Eichler:So you're getting to explore new things and sort of laugh with other people and enjoy time. Kind of like what you were able to do when you're in person. Yeah. Interesting. It sounds like you're accessing something that's in England that you probably wouldn't have been able to access before.
Anna Braunizer:Totally. And it's been, it's just been so I find it's been so rewarding. And there've been like choirs that do like project choirs, but they're based in Vancouver. So even as someone on Vancouver Island, that's like an hour and a half away, I wouldn't do it in Vancouver, but now it's like, Oh, they're online. Okay. I can join that late. It just opens up like the circle of belonging.
Jeanne Eichler:It really does. I mean, I think it's one of the biggest gifts of COVID is that we've learned how to use the virtual context to catch up with old friends or meet new ones, uh, and to network with people who we never would've had access to before. So those learning circles are bigger and it'll be interesting to see what happens when all of this is, is over the lasting effects. And, um, and, and how we're able to have access to people in other places much more easily. Yeah.
Anna Braunizer:I've made so many friends, just all around the world that I never would have met if it wasn't for COVID.
Emily Polovick-Moulds:Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely knocked down a lot of the barriers that we cannot perceive to be there. All of the different organizations that thought that it just wasn't possible- it wasn't doable- have now done it. And so now there's not that excuse. So we'll see. I I'm interested as well to see if when we are able to be more in person, if we'll still kind of have some hybrid approaches with some online and some in person or where we'll go from here.
Anna Braunizer:Yeah. Like how communities will exist. So interesting.
Jeanne Eichler:Well, you know, if I were to make it a music metaphor, because we're talking a little bit about music here, you know, part of, part of the beauty of music is the silence too. And when we put silence into our lives, we give ourselves space to find out what we don't know, or to experience things, to make room for things that we haven't been able to do before. And I've come to realize so much during this time that. It's so easy to get bogged down and to schedule our lives to the hilt. And certainly working from home. It's easy to continue to do that, but having those, those pieces of things that we can't access because of distancing. Uh, give us that, that silence or that space is opening up all kinds of invitation for us to look for, what am I going to do, or what can I do differently? Um, and, and that's fun and creative. And for me as an artist, as somebody who loves to, um, create and innovate, it's amazing to have that space. And I hope I can continue to do it.
Anna Braunizer:Yeah. Speaking of that analogy, like it just reminds me, um, with Mozart. So one of my favorite pieces to play on piano is Fantasia in G minor because it's full of pauses and it's full of different emotions. Like goes, it's all light. And then it's like pause and it's like all dramatic and angry. I was like, pause. And you can have those sounds as for as long or short as you want. But just like, that's basically one of my pieces. I always play if I'm stressed out, I'm like, I'm going to play this piece and just gonna let myself feel all the emotions and then process them and play it until I'm like done processing for this moment in time. But like, we can have those pauses and we can take those breaks and look at what's what's in those spaces and like move on from there and like figure it out.
Jeanne Eichler:Know what you're describing here. Yeah. Music therapy standpoint is that, you know, we can, we can experience so much in, in practice music and improv improvised music. So I do a lot of improvisation with drumming and with, with singing and, you know, with different instruments that I might use, but. You can also, if we, if we look at the music that we know and that we memorize and that we practice it does, and we have it perfect. It's never, ever the same twice. If we listened to it, if you were to record it, it's not the same. If we're part of it. If we interact with it, it's an incredibly powerful communication experience. And that to me is what makes it so powerful that live music, making even music that we practiced, what you're just describing. Like just getting emotionally involved with it is a way to keep ourselves well and, and to allow, you know, you allow things to be different. You'll allow those spaces to be different because you're hearing that dialogue in your head and you're participating and that's.
Anna Braunizer:Yeah. It's one of my favorite pieces. I love it too. I think it's a great piece.
Emily Polovick-Moulds:So I know from receiving the invite from you over Facebook, that you were involved in'year of the neighbor'. And so can you tell us a little bit about how that started, what it ended up being.
Jeanne Eichler:Well, actually, I was invited to do a, um, a radio interview back in December of 2019, where typically when OTs are asked to do interviews at that time, you talk about fall risk and slipping on the ice and things like that. And in my own true fashion, I didn't want to talk about fall risks anymore, because I feel like they've gotten that. They get it everywhere. And so what I wanted to talk about was the access to friendship, because I think that that in the winter time, especially when people go into their houses, we don't access our friends as often. And we, especially at that point, you know, it was, it was people who were elderly, who might go into their house, who might not get out very often anyway. And so their neighbors didn't know them. And so, as I was talking to the, uh, to the person who was interviewing me, um, I came up with this idea that maybe we needed to make it a year. Of the neighbor where we might get to know the people who live around us for our own safety, but also for just better wellness and it's stuck. And, and so I gave it to my students as an assignment and a wellness course that I was teaching, and I asked them to come up with ways to be better neighbors and to foster. Being a neighbor and they came up and then suddenly we went into underground for COVID. So they all did their own thing. Um, and they came up with all kinds of ideas from chalking on, uh, on, on sidewalks to, um, to. Doing some, something nice, like putting a thing at somebody's door to let them know. They were thinking about them to sending letters to people, um, delivering things or just calling people and telling them that they, that they were important to them. And all of those things were an incredible. Wave that started on our campus. And, um, and a lot of people entered into that movement and it was needed at the time. It was really important to be aware of how we could do things. So the year of the neighbor Facebook page was a place where people would generate ideas for ways that they had already reached out, or maybe challenge people on the list to do things with their neighbors or for their neighbors too. You know, foster that, um, in my own neighborhood, we adopted year of the neighbor at the beginning of the year. And of course it changed gears as soon as we all went into the underground. Um, and so what we did was very intentionally create a whole bunch of ways to interact. So we. Made an emission to, to get everyone's phone number. We made a lot of text groups. Uh, we offered to help each other, uh, made sure to introduce ourselves if we didn't know people, uh, we had walking and recreation groups so that we could interact safely outside. As I was telling you before we did front long distance singalongs and what we would call, sit and sips. Uh, decorated our homes for the enjoyment of those who walked by, like at Easter, we made treasure hunts for children, with pictures in our windows. Um, and we supported each other when we saw people doing things to stay healthy. Um, and one of the things that I'm hoping to do when we all get a little bit warmer here in Arkansas, is that I'd love to drum with my neighbors, but I think what we're going to do to stay safe with COVID is I'm going to have every neighbor bring. Household items like pots and pans, and we'll welcome spring and warmer weather in a few weeks. So if you want to do something like that, I'd highly recommended. It's a lot of fun.
Anna Braunizer:That's so cool. I, that, that I love, I love that. I mean, I love community. I love building community. Those are some of my biggest values in life and I think like I see in our world, we-sometimes we get so separate from each other. Um, I think it's really beautiful that you're like just creating these connections, like with everyone in your neighborhood, we had something similar. Um, I don't know if they had this in the States, but in BC, we had every evening at 7:00 PM, we'd' bring our pots out and our pans and we will bang them for the healthcare workers. So that was just something that we would do all the neighbors, just like getting out of their decks or like we would sometimes go in their backyards and we'd have these little moments like,'Oh my gosh, you're there too.' We're having a little bit of pot banging. And just, it was just those little moments of connection that can come from it. And how can we like connect more with our neighbors? I think that's something that.in the world, we really need.
Jeanne Eichler:Well and to be heard. You know it's, it's important, especially if we're by ourselves or we're in a strange situation or we're isolated, um, to be heard by someone else to be acknowledged by someone else. Even if we can't tell them what we're saying, you know, hitting, uh, hitting up pan might really express something from our standpoint that other people wouldn't understand exactly what you're expressing, but yeah. But it's, it's amazing to get some kind of a response from someone who doesn't even understand. And, and I think that that's, that's a real telling of w if we took that a bit further into our world and into our culture, um, you know, sometimes making a sound or, or being heard, being listened to is all we need. We don't need to agree with it or understand it. We just need to listen to it.
Emily Polovick-Moulds:Yeah. Listening is something that I think a lot of us have lost, lost a good ability to do, but I've, I have heard a lot more over the last year of people realizing, like we were saying earlier, just how important those silences are and how easy it is, you know, for families, especially to just over-scheduled themselves. And this year, when things were canceled, finding that. With more time, they actually connected in a way they didn't even realize that you hadn't before that there just hadn't been the time for it. So like we're saying, when you, when you have those pauses in music or in any form that it invites something more in, so making the time for it, it's, it's great to have.
Anna Braunizer:Well, wrapping uptoday, Jeanne, I'm wondering. Um, you talked a lot about music and community, and I'm wondering what one last golden nugget is that you would like to share with people interested in getting creative with the arts, like getting involved in the community- using arts in the community- to build community or wellbeing.
Jeanne Eichler:Well, this sounds really simple, but, um, all you need to do is just do it and frankly, you should do it loudly. Uh, be messy, really messy and laugh a lot. It's totally okay. What we create is reflective of the moment, as much as it is to invite our own self-expression. Um, you know, the creative arts always reflect a process. And we must participate in that process. So my challenge to the audience is how will you participate today?
Anna Braunizer:Thank you so much. It was really nice to meet you Jeanne! Music for the, Do What You Love podcast was provided by Purple Planet, a royalty free download service.